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2nd cycle help - bloat

gremlin707

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Hey guys.
I did my first cycle late last year based off what I learned here.
500mg Test C per week for 16 weeks.
Followed by 25mg Winstrol for 8 weeks at the end of my cycle.
Arimidex 0.5mg every second day.
PCT was 3 weeks of Clomid at 50mg per day followed by 4 weeks of Nolvadex at 20mg per day.

Had good gains. Very happy with the results. PCT went well. Except for quite bad back and shoulder acne that took months to clear up.

Major problem I had though was major bloating/water retention particularly in my face. Before I started the Arimidex at all it was unreal and people thought I was having an allergic reaction or something. I would drink 4 litres of water per religiously. Maybe too much salty food occasionally but not consistently. Any ideas of how to prevent this or at least help?
I wear a snapback hat and would have to add a hole easily I would get bloating in my face so bad.
Im in the process of getting a divorce and have started seeing a couple girls so id really like to not look like the Michelin man all of a sudden out of nowhere...

Also any thought on doing the same cycle again? Maybe 12 weeks Test instead of 16, but maybe 16 again. Possible Test400 with Test C and Test Un. Possibly 600mg per week instead of 500mg? Followed by 8 weeks of Winny again half way through.


Thanks for all the help everyone!!
 

Goldenrod

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Everyone reacts different to substances. Did you get Oedema everywhere, in your legs? Lower back pain at all or any other issues other than water retention? Issue breathing?
Did you loose all the water after?
That seems like an awful lot of water for a somewhat reasonable cycle. If it was me I would be getting checked out at the doctor - when it occurs. Not trying to freak you out but unless this is a prescription medication - you can’t be 100% sure what you are injections into yourself.
Lots of issues can cause bloating that aren’t related to estrogen. If your going to do another cycle, I would make sure to get blood work done and if it happens again see your doctor. Don’t mess with your health.
I’m not giving you a lot of help but significant water retention can be a symptom of many things.

I’m a little confused by your questions, “Possible Test400 with Test C and Test Un. Possibly 600mg per week instead of 500mg? Followed by 8 weeks of Winny again half way through.”
Regarding your questions on esters and dosages - I wouldn’t up my dosage in case this happens again. I’m a cautious person so if I was going to run another blast - I would try less and see how you fair out. You can always increase it. If this is your second run, keep it simple. One compound - otherwise if you have similar issues, you won’t be able pinpoint the issue.
A test cyp or a test enanthate is my preferred ester.
Should state I’m not the most experienced person with AI’s and a lot of the guys on here have forgot more than I know so they may give better advice.
If you do run another cycle and you start to bloat up - go to the pharmacy and get a urinalysis / Chem strip 10. They aren’t overly expensive for 50. Simple - dip the strip and if the colour changes it is a decent indication if your kidneys, liver, etc. Is unhappy. It isn’t as good as a blood test but are the same dips doctors use in their offices.
 

66Chevy

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Before I add opinion on 2nd cycle can you list the meals you were eating on a daily basis when you were experiencing the severe bloating? And how much junk were you eating honestly?

For some perspective, the one time I bloated up bad was ‘99 and I was running Omnadren250 amps. I remember my diet was not great and I was eating out more than normal, plus no AI, no cardio and water intake was less than optimal....when I see photos of myself from that period I am frankly embarrassed...
 

gremlin707

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66Chevy .. after reading this and thinking honestly on it I feel like the bloating may very well be diet related. Although I dont retain water like this off cycle, i definently did on cycle. I ate real clean until supper time. After my evening workout I would just want to eat protein and junk food
 

gremlin707

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Goldenrod...

No edema anywhere else really. Basically just the face. No other pains or strange symptoms. No issues breathing.
Winny seemed to make me cramp up easier. Basically just like a crazy pump.

I will look into those strips in the future.
Probably a good call not uping my Test dosage maybe.
I think cleaning up my diet alot would likely prevent my issues..
 

kaly11

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Before I add opinion on 2nd cycle can you list the meals you were eating on a daily basis when you were experiencing the severe bloating? And how much junk were you eating honestly?

For some perspective, the one time I bloated up bad was ‘99 and I was running Omnadren250 amps. I remember my diet was not great and I was eating out more than normal, plus no AI, no cardio and water intake was less than optimal....when I see photos of myself from that period I am frankly embarrassed...
Hit the nail on the head here.

Your diet will be the biggest factor in the amount of water you will be holding.....some of the leanest looks I have had was on a long ester test.

Control the carb intake ( time around workouts, no excessive amounts, see what works best for your body) best you can and you will see a difference!
 

gremlin707

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Okay guys so with a proper diet... what would you recommend for a 2nd cycle
 

66Chevy

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You ever heard of K.I.S.S.? And no, I’m not calling you stupid 😉

I like a simple 12-14 week test & deca cycle. Maybe 4-500 T-400 or C/E with 3-450 deca.

Could even add some low dose Dianabol (20-30mg/day) from weeks 8-11 of a 12 week cycle on the back end after you’ve gotten used to the deca.
 

gremlin707

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You ever heard of K.I.S.S.? And no, I’m not calling you stupid 😉

I like a simple 12-14 week test & deca cycle. Maybe 4-500 T-400 or C/E with 3-450 deca.

Could even add some low dose Dianabol (20-30mg/day) from weeks 8-11 of a 12 week cycle on the back end after you’ve gotten used to the deca.
Thanks!!
 

CurtisP

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I basically “wasted” my first cycle when I started AAS - I didn’t have a clue about diet - I was all “calories in VS calories out”
Didn’t care what the calories came from
First cycle of Test only and had double cheeseburgers from McDonald’s almost every day and mass gainer shakes and bags of chips and garbage plus an equivalent of Lake Ontario of water a day made me a watery bloated mess.
Finished the cycle - had got a coach for a bit and learned diet “properly” (I still use that term loosely as I feel I still have much to learn) and remained natural for another year and made better gains than when I did with AAS use, I just ordered my next cycle that will start around the 15th of September for 15 weeks and I am hoping with what I have learned from here and other sources I can put all that knowledge to good use.
Best of luck !
 

Goldenrod

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Goldenrod...

No edema anywhere else really. Basically just the face. No other pains or strange symptoms. No issues breathing.
Winny seemed to make me cramp up easier. Basically just like a crazy pump.

I will look into those strips in the future.
Probably a good call not uping my Test dosage maybe.
I think cleaning up my diet alot would likely prevent my issues..
morning @gremlin707 - if this is just diet related, many of my comments are not applicable. My head goes to certain issues when I think of significant oedema. This was a learning experience for me, I had no idea a bad diet could cause ‘significant water gain.’ Catch is significant, When you mentioned people thought you were having an allergic reaction and blowing up...I didn’t think diet could do it but Chevy knows much more than I do.
Best of luck.
 

Mooobaby

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What about trying to keep the bloating off by design and try something like 250 test 400 EQ? Not overly androgenic so might help skin, and half the estrogen so may help bloating?

Diets going to be key, but I'm a bloater and it sucks. Keeping the test lower and the junk food out of my house goes a long way to fixing that.
 

gremlin707

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What about trying to keep the bloating off by design and try something like 250 test 400 EQ? Not overly androgenic so might help skin, and half the estrogen so may help bloating?

Diets going to be key, but I'm a bloater and it sucks. Keeping the test lower and the junk food out of my house goes a long way to fixing that.
Just did a little reading on EQ and this sounds pretty appealing. Would 250 test a week be enough though in combination with the 400 EQ? I was under the impression 500 test a week was sort of the minimum.
 

Goldenrod

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I’m sure there will be people who argue but there is no minimum testosterone mg’s per week required. The least amount of test you can use to reach your goals the better. I know lots of guys on 200 mg per week for TRT and grow with no issues. Some guys are on 100-200 and add in another compound like boldenone for a blast. The test base doesn’t have to be 500 mg/week.
Good luck
 

Goldenrod

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I’m sure there will be people who argue but there is no minimum testosterone mg’s per week required. The least amount of test you can use to reach your goals the better. I know lots of guys on 200 mg per week for TRT and grow with no issues. Some guys are on 100-200 and add in another compound like boldenone for a blast. The test base doesn’t have to be 500 mg/week.
Good luck
And I should add, you can always start with a lower dosage and increase it if you wish. You may be one if the lucky people who don’t need that much to grow.
 

Mooobaby

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Just did a little reading on EQ and this sounds pretty appealing. Would 250 test a week be enough though in combination with the 400 EQ? I was under the impression 500 test a week was sort of the minimum.
All rules are guidelines for the most part. Not everyone turns into a marshmallow on 500mg test a week either. Do what works for you not everyone. Being bloated takes all the fun out of it so fuck that.
 

nitrous

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Just did a little reading on EQ and this sounds pretty appealing. Would 250 test a week be enough though in combination with the 400 EQ? I was under the impression 500 test a week was sort of the minimum.
It's no minimum. Lot of guys can make gains on less. When you add in other compounds it's still a combined amount of hormones that is way more than you'd naturally have. Like it was previous mentioned you can always start lower and adjust up accordingly if you feel it isn't enough. If you thought you bloated a lot on 500mg/week of test you'll likely bloat more on 600mg/week (assuming the diet is the same).

For the acne I find it's mostly from hormone fluctuations which is why some guys can get it bad when they go on or when they go off. Trying to limit mass fluctuations with tapering on and off may be a way to minimize that.
 

gremlin707

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What maximum length of time would be recommended for running EQ with the test. I ran for 16 weeks my first go and was thinking of doing the same timeline again.
 

JMan

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What maximum length of time would be recommended for running EQ with the test. I ran for 16 weeks my first go and was thinking of doing the same timeline again.
I would consider 16 weeks a minimum with EQ. Even 20 weeks if your test is only 250mg and those are your only 2 compounds.
 
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