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OPTICAN HGH reveiw

BCBabyB

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Hey guys, I am just curious, to those who are skeptical of Opti:

These threads with elevated IGF-1 or good HPLC results seem quite common.

I don't understand how sides like edema and carpal tunnel (which are sides of real GH) are used to discredit generics with good lab results? It seems like the common anecdotal story of "I get sore hands from generic but not pharma" is what should be doubted. Are there any proposed mechanisms that would make a UGL more likely to cause sides? I saw PH level mentioned in another thread but I would think that would effect the potency not cause more sides with less benefits.

I am genuinely asking for clarification here as I am new to this, and it seems a lot of the time to be old members with plenty of experience who tell the story of more sides with UGL as a way to vouch for pharma. Is this possibly a bias formed by experienced people who were around when UGL GH was actually shit? Because all I see now is verification that this shit is good through positive 191 HPLC and IGF-1 levels like the ones in this thread. 500IGF-1 on 3IU is what I've seen on pharma in legitimate studies, and is about as good as one can ask for.
 
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Affliction79

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Hey guys, I am just curious, to those who are skeptical of Opti:

These threads with elevated IGF-1 or good HPLC results seem quite common.

I don't understand how sides like edema and carpal tunnel (which are sides of real GH) are used to discredit generics with good lab results? It seems like the common anecdotal story of "I get sore hands from generic but not pharma" is what should be doubted. Are there any proposed mechanisms that would make a UGL more likely to cause sides? I saw PH level mentioned in another thread but I would think that would effect the potency not cause more sides with less benefits.

I am genuinely asking for clarification here as I am new to this, and it seems a lot of the time to be old members with plenty of experience who tell the story of more sides with UGL as a way to vouch for pharma. Is this possibly a bias formed by experienced people who were around when UGL GH was actually shit? Because all I see now is verification that this shit is good through positive 191 HPLC and IGF-1 levels like the ones in this thread. 500IGF-1 on 3IU is what I've seen on pharma in legitimate studies, and is about as good as one can ask for.

Quite simply for me is I can train easy when I don’t have those sides. One thing I notice also with pharma is how easy the powder reconstitutes, so it makes me wonder about quality. Lastly results seem better with pharma, MUCH BETTER. That’s just me personally. Nothing wrong with Optis just not my personal choice.
 

BCBabyB

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Quite simply for me is I can train easy when I don’t have those sides. One thing I notice also with pharma is how easy the powder reconstitutes, so it makes me wonder about quality. Lastly results seem better with pharma, MUCH BETTER. That’s just me personally. Nothing wrong with Optis just not my personal choice.

I understand, the powder reconstitution makes sense, and your personal experience does too, I've seen lots of your replies in other threads researching. I've seen you in other threads where people are making this "lower quality = more sides, less effects" claim, what's your take on it?

I basically am asking for a mechanism behind the idea that its even possible for HGH of 'lower quality' to produce more sides with less wanted effects. The 'quality' making it more likely to produce the side effects (edema, carpal tunnel) specific to that compound but not the wanted effects (fat loss, better skin) doesn't make any intuitive sense to me, just wondering if there is a mechanism I am missing or if this is purely just anecdotal.

Think of that in the context of any other drug; would low quality Cialis make a runny nose more likely without improved blood circulation? Would low quality testosterone make aromatization more likely without anabolism? Would lower quality DNP make you overheat more without fat loss? Would lower quality opioids make you more ichy with less pain relief? These are all obviously no. The effects of IGF-1 being positive or negative is literally arbitrary to the body; the idea that having more carpal tunnel without more fat loss is even possible due to quality makes no sense to me.

I know everyone isn't saying this and the rest of the claims against generics I've got no issue with, but this being repeated all the time has confused me, maybe I'm just fixated.
 

Affliction79

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I understand, the powder reconstitution makes sense, and your personal experience does too, I've seen lots of your replies in other threads researching. I've seen you in other threads where people are making this "lower quality = more sides, less effects" claim, what's your take on it?

I basically am asking for a mechanism behind the idea that its even possible for HGH of 'lower quality' to produce more sides with less wanted effects. The 'quality' making it more likely to produce the side effects (edema, carpal tunnel) specific to that compound but not the wanted effects (fat loss, better skin) doesn't make any intuitive sense to me, just wondering if there is a mechanism I am missing or if this is purely just anecdotal.

Think of that in the context of any other drug; would low quality Cialis make a runny nose more likely without improved blood circulation? Would low quality testosterone make aromatization more likely without anabolism? Would lower quality DNP make you overheat more without fat loss? Would lower quality opioids make you more ichy with less pain relief? These are all obviously no. The effects of IGF-1 being positive or negative is literally arbitrary to the body; the idea that having more carpal tunnel without more fat loss is even possible due to quality makes no sense to me.

I know everyone isn't saying this and the rest of the claims against generics I've got no issue with, but this being repeated all the time has confused me, maybe I'm just fixated.

maybe it’s 191 vs 192?could be dimer? I’m just giving you my experience. If opti did exactly what humatrope did for me, I’d be using it and saving money. I think the guys repeating it like 3ml are basing it off decades of personal experience. I also think there’s a reason pros use as much pharma over generic as possible. Sorry I couldnt give you more scientific reasons just anecdotal, but I will say I think the guys that push really hard to say (I’m not referring to you) this generic or that generic are just as good as this pharma or that pharma, are guys with vested financial interests in generics. @PacMan can maybe explain to you from a bodybuilders standpoint why as well. For me, you can show me all the science in the world, but if a gh leans me out quicker and better and it lacks shitty ass side effects, I will pay the money. What’s your take? What have you experienced with pharma vs generic?
 

3ml

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I understand, the powder reconstitution makes sense, and your personal experience does too, I've seen lots of your replies in other threads researching. I've seen you in other threads where people are making this "lower quality = more sides, less effects" claim, what's your take on it?

I basically am asking for a mechanism behind the idea that its even possible for HGH of 'lower quality' to produce more sides with less wanted effects. The 'quality' making it more likely to produce the side effects (edema, carpal tunnel) specific to that compound but not the wanted effects (fat loss, better skin) doesn't make any intuitive sense to me, just wondering if there is a mechanism I am missing or if this is purely just anecdotal.

Think of that in the context of any other drug; would low quality Cialis make a runny nose more likely without improved blood circulation? Would low quality testosterone make aromatization more likely without anabolism? Would lower quality DNP make you overheat more without fat loss? Would lower quality opioids make you more ichy with less pain relief? These are all obviously no. The effects of IGF-1 being positive or negative is literally arbitrary to the body; the idea that having more carpal tunnel without more fat loss is even possible due to quality makes no sense to me.

I know everyone isn't saying this and the rest of the claims against generics I've got no issue with, but this being repeated all the time has confused me, maybe I'm just fixated.


First off I find it odd you come here to state this case, not on the two boards where opti sources.

So it sounds like the only "intuitive sense" you can make from experienced members sharing their experiences are that they are jaded?

I will not deny for one second that there are good tests on opti.

What I also dont think is you can deny is that the things create very strong side effects for most people. I wont run them anymore. If I cannot run 4iu of gh without my bones feeling like they are breaking, my stomach is badly swollen with fluid and I cant even grip my cock long enough to jerk off...something is fucked up. I dont have the answer. We do discuss though and bounce ideas off each other trying to figure it out.

Do I think opti is trying to fuck people? No I dont. Results wise these are up there with TPs products. Side effect wise in my opinion they are at another level I have never seen.

You seemed to be thinking people are saying its low quality. You had the comparison to Cialis.
Well I am not a chemist but to use your comparison of Cialis. If there is something slightly different, is it not plausible that sides and results could cary to some degree? GH is a very complicated beast vs Cialis so I really dont think that is a fair comparison.
 

BCBabyB

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maybe it’s 191 vs 192?could be dimer? I’m just giving you my experience. If opti did exactly what humatrope did for me, I’d be using it and saving money. I think the guys repeating it like 3ml are basing it off decades of personal experience. I also think there’s a reason pros use as much pharma over generic as possible. Sorry I couldnt give you more scientific reasons just anecdotal, but I will say I think the guys that push really hard to say (I’m not referring to you) this generic or that generic are just as good as this pharma or that pharma, are guys with vested financial interests in generics. @PacMan can maybe explain to you from a bodybuilders standpoint why as well. For me, you can show me all the science in the world, but if a gh leans me out quicker and better and it lacks shitty ass side effects, I will pay the money. What’s your take? What have you experienced with pharma vs generic?

I have no experience with Opti or Pharma GH. I am a keyboard warrior in the context of GH, and what I say should be taken with a grain of salt. If not for the quality of the members repeating this claim that bothered me I would have just thought of it as anecdotal nonsense and moved on, but the amount and significance of the people saying it really make me think there is something there. What is the function of dimer %? Is it just a rating of purity?


First off I find it odd you come here to state this case, not on the two boards where opti sources.

So it sounds like the only "intuitive sense" you can make from experienced members sharing their experiences are that they are jaded?

I will not deny for one second that there are good tests on opti.

What I also dont think is you can deny is that the things create very strong side effects for most people. I wont run them anymore. If I cannot run 4iu of gh without my bones feeling like they are breaking, my stomach is badly swollen with fluid and I cant even grip my cock long enough to jerk off...something is fucked up. I dont have the answer. We do discuss though and bounce ideas off each other trying to figure it out.

Do I think opti is trying to fuck people? No I dont. Results wise these are up there with TPs products. Side effect wise in my opinion they are at another level I have never seen.

You seemed to be thinking people are saying its low quality. You had the comparison to Cialis.
Well I am not a chemist but to use your comparison of Cialis. If there is something slightly different, is it not plausible that sides and results could cary to some degree? GH is a very complicated beast vs Cialis so I really dont think that is a fair comparison.

I agree that this side effect claim is common and made by reputable people, which is why I am searching for a mechanism behind it rather than dismissing it. I was just using the drugs I listed as a comparison to illustrate that in the context of 'sides' specific to a mechanism of the drug, it seems unlikely that you could have one without the other. I could not imagine being able to alter DNP in a way where it causes heat but not fat loss you know? But I'm no chemist either. Intuitively my knee jerk reaction is to think that this doesn't make sense, but like I said its not randoms saying this, its oldheads so can't dismiss it.

I made the post here because here is where I found the most interesting and objective discussion on the topic by the most knowledgeable people, two of which already responded to my post. Cheers fellas.
 
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I have no experience with Opti or Pharma GH. I am a keyboard warrior in the context of GH, and what I say should be taken with a grain of salt. If not for the quality of the members repeating this claim that bothered me I would have just thought of it as anecdotal nonsense and moved on, but the amount and significance of the people saying it really make me think there is something there. What is the function of dimer %? Is it just a rating of purity?




I agree that this side effect claim is common and made by reputable people, which is why I am searching for a mechanism behind it rather than dismissing it. I was just using the drugs I listed as a comparison to illustrate that in the context of 'sides' specific to a mechanism of the drug, it seems unlikely that you could have one without the other. I could not imagine being able to alter DNP in a way where it causes heat but not fat loss you know? Would it be possible that 192 just causes the negative effects? Intuitively yes, my knee jerk reaction is to think that this doesn't make sense, but like I said its not randoms saying this its oldheads so can't dismiss it.

I made the post here because here is where I found the most interesting and objective discussion on the topic by the most knowledgeable people, two of which already responded to my post.

I think this is a fair question to ask.

I have my own ever changing and evolving theories with GH. I have not run pharma long enough to see how long it would take me to get sides. After using optis for about 7-8 months at 4iu a day, I can’t even make a fist until about lunch time. When I grab my phone or a fork or a tool at work, my hands go numb within a minute.

it did take quite a while to get those effects and the only way I could compare to pharma would be to run pharma equally as long (which I do plan on doing) but 8 months of pharma at 4iu a day is quite the price tag.

I should add that I’m very pleased with the physical results of running 4iu of optis that long.

As for the mechanism of action that would create more sides for generics vs pharma... it is pretty hard to narrow down differences. I don’t think anyone really has an outstanding understanding of the complete pharmacology of GH.

the best example I can think of is comparing pharma to pharma. Think of comparing Genotropins to Omnitropes. They are both 191aa GH with purity and dimer well within FDA certified limitations. They both have a PH that should be adequately absorbable by the body. All 191 amino acids are in the same sequence and on paper they are virtually identical.

yet if you were to come and read the reviews here, you would see that almost all the experienced guys much much much prefer genos over omni’s.

on paper they are for the most part completely identical, but then from our experience using them we know that’s not necessarily the case, which tells us there’s more to it than just what we can see on paper.

I think the question behind the mechanism of action that causes these sides specifically in generics vs pharma is probably going to be way over everyone’s head that you can ask here. All we can really do is share our experience. I do for sure know that @3ml is an extremely experienced guy with no agenda and I know he’s not making these claims up, he has nothing to benefit either way. I’m sure he would love to pay a third of the price and use generics if the results were the same.

Back about a year ago I called some pharmacuetical engineering university professors at an extremely accredited canadian university and they were able to give me great answers based off the questions I asked. If you really want a scientific in depth answer, maybe this is the best route to take?
 

dane.dawg

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I have been running Opti since September 3iu AM and the first three months the sides were just as 3ML states but after the four month mark the bloat and cp went away for some reason. Now I do to 2iu AM/PM with no sides go figure..
 

BCBabyB

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I think this is a fair question to ask.

I have my own ever changing and evolving theories with GH. I have not run pharma long enough to see how long it would take me to get sides. After using optis for about 7-8 months at 4iu a day, I can’t even make a fist until about lunch time. When I grab my phone or a fork or a tool at work, my hands go numb within a minute.

it did take quite a while to get those effects and the only way I could compare to pharma would be to run pharma equally as long (which I do plan on doing) but 8 months of pharma at 4iu a day is quite the price tag.

I should add that I’m very pleased with the physical results of running 4iu of optis that long.

As for the mechanism of action that would create more sides for generics vs pharma... it is pretty hard to narrow down differences. I don’t think anyone really has an outstanding understanding of the complete pharmacology of GH.

the best example I can think of is comparing pharma to pharma. Think of comparing Genotropins to Omnitropes. They are both 191aa GH with purity and dimer well within FDA certified limitations. They both have a PH that should be adequately absorbable by the body. All 191 amino acids are in the same sequence and on paper they are virtually identical.

yet if you were to come and read the reviews here, you would see that almost all the experienced guys much much much prefer genos over omni’s.

on paper they are for the most part completely identical, but then from our experience using them we know that’s not necessarily the case, which tells us there’s more to it than just what we can see on paper.

I think the question behind the mechanism of action that causes these sides specifically in generics vs pharma is probably going to be way over everyone’s head that you can ask here. All we can really do is share our experience. I do for sure know that @3ml is an extremely experienced guy with no agenda and I know he’s not making these claims up, he has nothing to benefit either way. I’m sure he would love to pay a third of the price and use generics if the results were the same.

Back about a year ago I called some pharmacuetical engineering university professors at an extremely accredited canadian university and they were able to give me great answers based off the questions I asked. If you really want a scientific in depth answer, maybe this is the best route to take?

Nail on the head mate, I was just wondering if there was something I was completely missing, the pharma vs pharma example really illustrates the unknowns well. GH is complicated as shit and new to me.

Really appreciate the responses from all three of the vets, exactly what I was hoping for.

If I end up going that route and try to find out the specific pharmacology I will let you know what I find, but right now I am feeling like I did my due diligence and its about time to start injecting unidentified internet liquids into my body.
 

nomorals

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Nail on the head mate, I was just wondering if there was something I was completely missing, the pharma vs pharma example really illustrates the unknowns well. GH is complicated as shit and new to me.

Really appreciate the responses from all three of the vets, exactly what I was hoping for.

If I end up going that route and try to find out the specific pharmacology I will let you know what I find, but right now I am feeling like I did my due diligence and its about time to start injecting unidentified internet liquids into my body.

I never got that high but I didn't have the sides and I think anyone saying it must be good because of carpal tunnel etc is some old school bullshit. But like cummins said the tests show they are quality but none of us have an answer as to why they don't act exactly like pharma. Not to say they are bad at all.

They are definitely not 192 vs 191 HPLC testing can differiante between that and I think you would be hard pressed to find 192 these days over just shitty/low dose 191 imo.

As we always say around here and everywhere if you can afford it get the juicy pharmacy grade.

My experience is Opti grey tops and red tops (the 0 dimer ones not the 280iu kits) at 4 months ranging between 2-3iu daily. I mostly use it for fat loss so I keep the dose low and didn't get crazy carpal tunnel or anything. But I have had that feeling with my arms falling asleep back when I tried Primatropins waaay back.
 

Chapman83

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Sorry to bump an old thread but the sides from opti are so harsh😭 I couldn’t even stick to it long enough to see if it’s good or not I literally can’t do my job properly when I tried those had to stop
 

nomorals

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Sorry to bump an old thread but the sides from opti are so harsh😭 I couldn’t even stick to it long enough to see if it’s good or not I literally can’t do my job properly when I tried those had to stop

What dose and were you using the greys or the 280iu or whatever larger kits? Nothing compares to pharma but Opti is probably neck and neck with TP's GH for generics if you're going the generic route. AFAIK the 280 kits are made by a completely different lab and always test with dimmer and lower purity. I'd always go with the 100s/120s if I'm gonna go generic then well, I don't want to generic and the cheaper one.

I had no major sides except horrible sleep but I never went about 2-2.5iu just for fat loss and other benefits. I think when you get deep into heavy dosages of GH it's hard to be side free. What's always worked for me when I start up again is just up it by 1iu a week till I hit what I want instead of jumping in.
 

Chapman83

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What dose and were you using the greys or the 280iu or whatever larger kits? Nothing compares to pharma but Opti is probably neck and neck with TP's GH for generics if you're going the generic route. AFAIK the 280 kits are made by a completely different lab and always test with dimmer and lower purity. I'd always go with the 100s/120s if I'm gonna go generic then well, I don't want to generic and the cheaper one.

I had no major sides except horrible sleep but I never went about 2-2.5iu just for fat loss and other benefits. I think when you get deep into heavy dosages of GH it's hard to be side free. What's always worked for me when I start up again is just up it by 1iu a week till I hit what I want instead of jumping in.
I was using 280 iu purple tops 3iu
 

Chapman83

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What dose and were you using the greys or the 280iu or whatever larger kits? Nothing compares to pharma but Opti is probably neck and neck with TP's GH for generics if you're going the generic route. AFAIK the 280 kits are made by a completely different lab and always test with dimmer and lower purity. I'd always go with the 100s/120s if I'm gonna go generic then well, I don't want to generic and the cheaper one.

I had no major sides except horrible sleep but I never went about 2-2.5iu just for fat loss and other benefits. I think when you get deep into heavy dosages of GH it's hard to be side free. What's always worked for me when I start up again is just up it by 1iu a week till I hit what I want instead of jumping in.
From all the tests and stuff apparently it’s awesome high but I’m gonna just say fuck it and hold out till I find a way to get a script for a good amount of pharma I don’t trust buying that shit from sources either I want it from a doctor in my name or I’m not gonna gamble can never get a sure answer besides generic sucks compared to pharma so I’ll just accept that until my time comes
 

nomorals

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From all the tests and stuff apparently it’s awesome high but I’m gonna just say fuck it and hold out till I find a way to get a script for a good amount of pharma I don’t trust buying that shit from sources either I want it from a doctor in my name or I’m not gonna gamble can never get a sure answer besides generic sucks compared to pharma so I’ll just accept that until my time comes

I believe the same main guy for Opti's brings in actual Jintropins that are pharma that can be verified via app/security features but they are probably ~3x the cost per kit.

But yeah I'd love to do a pharma run of my lil 2-3iu/day to see if I notice the difference on my cut.
 

Chapman83

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I believe the same main guy for Opti's brings in actual Jintropins that are pharma that can be verified via app/security features but they are probably ~3x the cost per kit.

But yeah I'd love to do a pharma run of my lil 2-3iu/day to see if I notice the difference on my cut.
I’m to chicken to buy pharma from a source to much paper for me to gamble with what if it got wrecked In transit etc etc I’m sure he’s a solid dude that’s just to risky for me
 

Chapman83

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What dose and were you using the greys or the 280iu or whatever larger kits? Nothing compares to pharma but Opti is probably neck and neck with TP's GH for generics if you're going the generic route. AFAIK the 280 kits are made by a completely different lab and always test with dimmer and lower purity. I'd always go with the 100s/120s if I'm gonna go generic then well, I don't want to generic and the cheaper one.

I had no major sides except horrible sleep but I never went about 2-2.5iu just for fat loss and other benefits. I think when you get deep into heavy dosages of GH it's hard to be side free. What's always worked for me when I start up again is just up it by 1iu a week till I hit what I want instead of jumping in.
Is there anyway I can just use the opti and take something to get rid of that crazy pain in my wrist and hands? I’m not bashing opti one bit I would definitely at least finish the rest of what I have if there was a way make it more
Tolerable
 

nomorals

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Is there anyway I can just use the opti and take something to get rid of that crazy pain in my wrist and hands? I’m not bashing opti one bit I would definitely at least finish the rest of what I have if there was a way make it more
Tolerable

I know you're probably soured on generics but literally every guy ive seen with complaints similar to yours is 100% been the purple or larger 280kits that he sources from an entirely different lab. Could be the purity/dimmer content in them but besides ramping them up slowly 1iu at a time I don't have much advice.

I've never ran the cheaper ones, people have rave reviews over the 100-120iu kits that come from the "good factory" and the HPLC reflects this. I've seen a few complaints on CTS/water retention etc on the cheaper kits. I would chalk it up to that over anything.
 

Chapman83

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I know you're probably soured on generics but literally every guy ive seen with complaints similar to yours is 100% been the purple or larger 280kits that he sources from an entirely different lab. Could be the purity/dimmer content in them but besides ramping them up slowly 1iu at a time I don't have much advice.

I've never ran the cheaper ones, people have rave reviews over the 100-120iu kits that come from the "good factory" and the HPLC reflects this. I've seen a few complaints on CTS/water retention etc on the cheaper kits. I would chalk it up to that over anything.
Hmmmm interesting so you think if I go with the smaller kits I’d have better luck? That’s crazy I had no idea I thought same lab same hgh fuck maybe I’ll give the smaller kit a go that sucks I wish I bought that to begin with
 

nomorals

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Hmmmm interesting so you think if I go with the smaller kits I’d have better luck? That’s crazy I had no idea I thought same lab same hgh fuck maybe I’ll give the smaller kit a go that sucks I wish I bought that to begin with

Yes it's hard to dig through the thread as he's been around forever now but the 100-120iu kits are apparently from a "GMP Facility" now I'm not gonna verify GMP but the blind and source HPLC's on them are stellar and I think Jano said they rate as some of the best he's seen after adding in the more sensitive testing.

The other ones come from a completely separate lab and always test at lower purity and with dimer content in them. No one knows why high purity generics don't just hit the same or the same as pharma but I'm not a fan of dimer content in my generics and I'd assume that could be the reason behind the more reported sides. The 50 bucks or whatever you say is not worth it imo, if you are already going generic, why not the best generics you can find?

I used the red 120s then the grey 120s from the "good" lab and had nothing like what you described.

At this point I wouldn't touch generics besides the smaller kits or TP's mauves, after that I'm just forking out for some sort of pharma. Baffles me the guys on other sites that just order generic ass tops off alibaba rolling the dice on that shit with zero testing.
 
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